Saint-Antonio/[StormyLegions]Coldy

K how about we start out u get 2 archers and 4 full inf units i get 6 hurlers and 10 chariots..We start out like that deal?

I mean that should be fair right?

If louis does support Antonio in this situation..I then have totally lost my repsect to Saints clan , because Antonio quit when he had 4 pike's left almost dead, and about to rout..

Louis it's in your hands my friend be honest or help yuor clannie out and make this tourney and your caln look like fools...

No more discussions b/c i just wnat your decision Louie!

|StormyLegions|Coldy

YellowMelon a écrit:

Coldy could have won by finishing off his ammo, and even skirmishing with light chariots. Plus his chariots had uphill, plus elephants were rampaging his own guys (right there coldy could have rushed him and he was dead while the lines were broken), plus it without a general and the decreased moral from the heads, Coldy was clearly victorious.

Well said.

While it is true that 4 phalanx could beat 10 chariots if they were in a box formation, or maybe even 6 headhurlers alone if they charged, they were together. The headhurlers would chew up any thing immoble, and the charries would chew up anything moving. If they were light chariots they could have destroyed the phalanx in skirmish mode with a cpu at the controls.

Just looking at the pictures, the headhurlers were downhill and to the flank and the charries uphill. So basically, in a theoretical world where he could make the perfect formation before the action started, he would still not be able to win unless coldy stopped playing. One phalanx would need to be sent downhill or they would be destroyed by those HH, and two would need to be sent to the flank (since that seemed to be the biggest concentration of HH) That would leave 1 theoretical phalanx to guard against 10 chariots.

However, the problem is that the HH downhill and those to the flank are spaced out enough is that one phalanx could not cover them both, and because you can really hit phalanx from either the side or rear with phalanx it wouldn't even be enough to cover one. So basically, best case for the selucids be 2 phalanx to defeat 4-5 headhurlers (attacking flank) while under HH fire and 2 phalanx to cover the flank as well as they could have, which with 10 chariots i doubt they could do it very well. However, the phalanx are facing the wrong way and in phalanx mode, and there is some distance between them and the side HH, so they would also have to take at least 1 or 2 full HH barrage.

They are probably shaken from all the losses around them. Six headhurlers with two full barrages should take them to probably near half strength. Hell, today I played battles where I mass routed 5-6 silver shield pikes which were fresh/eager and at ful lstrength with 4 Headhurlers before the melee started. headhurlers would then melee and flank the phalanxes, and chariots, which even if he tried to block he couldn't.

Simply put, those phalanx don't stand a chance. It doesn't matter how the disconnect happened, coldy should get the win and you guys can play game 2. Its not that hard to come back from one loss to win,s o I'm wondering what the big deal is.

right NImble Nota and sorry Coldy
but tis true that in that situation if hurlers still have ammo
Antonio is absolutely dead
now we have to check if Louis is arbiter or Saint it this tourney

If you watch the replay the head hurlers had already been firing upon the inf. for some time, so they were most certainly either out of ammo, or very close to being out of ammo. That is why they were not firing much at the very end of the replay.

Further more, if the spears could have gotten back into a good formation, than they could have easily killed the chariots. Antonio could have easily done this because the chariots were running in the opposite direction so that they could regroup. This further more suggests that the chariots had a very low moral at the time of the finish of the replay. Also, while Coldy did have about 10 chariots left, many of the chariots were already damaged from attacking the spears.

Obviously, there is a good chance that Antonio would have won. It would be unfair to give him the loss when he still could have won, and it is not his fault that net probs happened. This indicates clearly that the battle should be replayed since there was no obvious winner.

Citation :

If you watch the replay the head hurlers had already been firing upon the inf. for some time, so they were most certainly either out of ammo, or very close to being out of ammo.

They fired 2-3 vollies and I believe HeadHurler's get 5-6 vollies TenjoHeadHurler will have to correct me there if I am wrong, so they still had ammo and were firing right up to the point where Antonio alt tabbed to crash the game and avoid the defeat.

Citation :

Further more, if the spears could have gotten back into a good formation, than they could have easily killed the chariots

ROFL how could four units of pikes get back into formation while being attacked by an elephant unit? This makes any regrouping impossible, and four units of pike could only beat 10 chariots in a box formation, he had no time to do this, he was surrounded.

Citation :

Antonio could have easily done this because the chariots were running in the opposite direction so that they could regroup.

Easily with the elies running around in their own ranks? I don't think so m8 guess again. And did you even notice that Coldy had light chariots too, he was probably going to skirmish the pikes with head hurlers and light chariots which would end the match for a Coldy victory very easily.

Citation :

This further more suggests that the chariots had a very low moral at the time of the finish of the replay

No it does not, notice that when Coldy's general died his army did not flee in mass, do you know why? Because his troops had a very high morale from killing hundreds of Antonio's soldiers, Antonio was the one with low morale. So Guess again.

Citation :

Also, while Coldy did have about 10 chariots left, many of the chariots were already damaged from attacking the spears.

Ok I really think you did not even watch the replay ROFL only one unit of chariots even engaged spears that match (Coldy's general) so he had 10 units of fully stocked Hvy charies, Light charies, and Barb warlords, you should really learn to pay attention m8 LMAO.

Citation :

Obviously, there is a good chance that Antonio would have won.

No there is not a good chance at all, and it is anything but obvious. Look at HeadHurler's post he is the master of Briton and if you do not believe me go play him. It took him a whole day of going through the facts to come to that conclusion, which is totally true. Skull I know you love your clan and want to protect Antonio, but you must see the truth, Antonio just does not want to admit defeat where the game was hopeless to his cause.

Citation :

It would be unfair to give him the loss when he still could have won, and it is not his fault that net probs happened.

He had no chance Skull absolutely none and if you don't believe me watch and see if Antonio accepts Coldy's suggestion for the rematch. Should be fair right cause that is the units they had at the end 4 pikes, 2 archers for Antonio and 6 headhurlers and 10 chariots for Coldy. So if Antonio truly believes he could have won let him fight that way.

And for the net probs I think if Coldy saved a screenshot of the message saying Antonio was causing net probs, then it would be proof that he alt tabbed and it was his fault.

Citation :

This indicates clearly that the battle should be replayed since there was no obvious winner

Sure replay the match with the units they had left under their control at the end of the game

4 Pikes for antonio and 2 archers

and then 10 chariots for Coldy and 6 HeadHurlers

That is fair right since that is what they had? And you are so sure Antonio could have won with what he had left, so sure fight with what units they had.

Thank you HOLY SKULL CERNO for your objectivity !!
I yours to do share gives Louis that I do not recognize in no case sreens
shots of Nimble noted and co .
Besides , he soupconne those to have to take advantage of the disconnection to take those sreens shots after the I a to takens the hand on my army.
I persist and I sign, it was remaining me 6 pikemen and non 4 + 1 elephant smack forms !!!
I contest sharply this machination and insisite on the fact that the match
was being won for my sake !!
Now, to confirm you all that purpose Louis, I have in my possesion a few
screens shots of Nimble Noted insulting our tournament, I remain to your disposition for you to send them and to insist on the fact that you must
arbitrate our matches neighbours !!!
What would have been able to do a few trolleys facing my pikemen + my elephant !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I remain scandalized by this nasty me of Codly who has done follow a petition itempestive against me in the room.

GBY

As to you SC KROOK

Your purpose are not gratifying, you are not objective, and single person me and know me why...
You remain on 2 defeats against me what you have not to digest, then
forcemment, you tryed to penetrate me, Yes, effectively, I have punished you 2 times immediately , you have besides said me at last of those 2 defeats that you were being bad losing, veiled why your opinion is not reliable.. then go and see elsewhere svp !!!
Coldy was being far from to win, worse still, it was being losing .. If Coldy is so on of him, what it would come to remake me face with memes armed déja established...
Coldy, would know that I am a veteran and the fact to have to take advantage of my disconnection have you to favour to continue the match facing the IA , after cost, this is easy for you to put in stage your scenario.
That does not walk ! you were being lost !!!!!!!!!
And attention, not to mix not everything, this was an electricity cut and non a fond of games who gives up the play !!!

GBY

Antonio Screenshots do not lie.... but you do tsk tsk If Louis comes back and gives this decision to you unfairly many people will drop from this joke of a tournament in support of Coldy and what is right.

Grow up Antonio the screens show you had 4 pikes and 2 depleted archers, your elephants were not in your control and they were hurting you, the chances of winning for you did not exist, now just admit your defeat and play game #2 and don't alt tab this time

Nimble, you aggravate me,

You are not objective, all those do not regard you , I you have him says...
You speak without knowledge, work tone to influence Louis will not work !!
Comes out of this history and goes then to drag you bus Louis will not save you...
You are of bad faith , it was remaining me 6 pikemen + 1 elephants, this is a certitude.. And as SKULL CERNO was specifying him so well, chariots were not having none chance. Everything this is a machination..would be The part was being actually to me !!!
The tournament must advance and Coldy refuses the confrontation, why ???
Here you are on our forum, it is not question to influence one or such person, play for who you are very strong. screens shots that I have caught yesterday are very detective of your true personality.
But says you well, what it has not no more mulish that a spanish !!!!!!!!!!!
Coldy can account oneself lucky of this disconnection...

GBY

Ok from what I see of your english you still fail to grasp the idea that I took screenshots showing how you were beaten bad and had only 4 Pikes and no control of the elies. Even after TenjoHeadhurler the King of Briton in RTW posted and explained how you had no chance you still act like a child refusing to admit your defeat, it is obvious you can not swallow your pride but sometimes it is the best thing to do for all parties involved now just admit you were defeated and play game #2

thank you have a good day

Or better yet play the rematch with 4 Pikes and two archers vs 6 head hurlers and 10 chariots that is fair right? that is what you both had and you are so confident you would win under those conditions so fight that way.

Now I see why Tomi removed you as emmisary in CWC your arguments make less sense then your English, claiming you have elies when they are clearly running amok( as demonstrated in the screenshot)

Headhurlers (and all javelin units in general) seem to have some weird fractional amount of ammo. I think they get off either 4 or 5 heads (forget if it was 4 or 5) and then after that about a fourth of the unit throws a volley while the others do the animation but do not throw.

I did not watch the replay, because I was told that it was long and boring and not worth it. However, as far as I know, elephants that run amok never reform. I don't use them or fight them much, but pretty much the only way to gain control of amok elephants is to order them to die, in which you gain control of them for about the 2 seconds between when you clicked and when they die.

Chariots vs Phalanx is a very sticky topic. It is true that if you charge a single chariot into a single phalanx, it will be destroyed without doin anything (if it is head on.) If you charge a single Chariot into the rear of fresh phalanx, it will disrupt them but usually ends up in fron and dies.

However, people that play me know that my army is a routing one, not a killing one. Often phalanxes reform, and I have to use chariots to stop a mass reformation (which I have lost many games too) In these cases, if I charge a single chariot into the rear of a reformed phalanx, even if it has had time to "cool off" and not be so scared, it insta-routes about 70% of the time. Sometimes, I've had a single damaged chariot route undo a mass reformation by charging into the rear of an exposed phalanx, routing it and causing a chain route.

My standard British army only has 9 chariots, and usually when I'm fighting phalanxes I only have 5-6 left from killing cav and skirmishing with archers. I've never tried charging 10 Chariots straight into a phalanx, but with that many a raw charge might disrupt a phalanx enough for to make it just like a sub-par swordsmen unit that would be highly broken up, which might allow HH to raw melee it. It would be an interesting test, and you and coldy could try it if you wanted.

However, you would need your pikes at least 3-4 lines deep to fight the Headhurlers and have a chance in raw melee. Even with chariots again'st phalanx, a single rear guard probably couldn't keep them out, since it would be 2 lines deep and would get disrupted/pushed into the fighting front guard. So you would need two to cover the back.

So, the best case scenario is two Phalanx fighting 6 Headhurlers in raw melee. The phalanx formations are pretty much going to be disrupted no matter how you cut it, because 10 chariots, even if they don't break though, would be much wider (even if densely packed) than two phalanx units, so pretty much the lfanks of the front phalanxes would be hit.

So its two phalanx units in sword mode vs 6 headhurlers. Its a simple test. Thats assuming everything in Antonio's favor. So if you want an objective test, just do that, phalanxes with spears up charging into headhurlers with fire at will off, no flanking or anything fancy, see who wins.

Ok, So I watched the replay. Here are some facts for the moment it said "Replay ended"
1) The Elephants were running amok when the replay ended.
2) There were 10 chariots left, 9 were almost at full strength (30 more more men left, 36 is default on that setting) 1 had 20 men left.
3) There were 6 headhurlers left, 4 still had ammo. It is impossible to tell if those were full volleys or not, but on at least two of them (The downhill ones from the phalanx) it seemed like it was a full volley because the majority of the men were firing (the rest were either meleeing phalanx or might have been reloading, don't know)
4) 1 Phalanx was wavering with a "Defeat is a distinct possibility" 2 were shaken, 2 were steady. 1 of the steadies and one of the shaken had defeat is almost certain. There was one shaken and one steady not in combat, they had the elephant going through them. There were 5 phalanxes left, not 4.

The headhurlers to the side for the most part were listed as marching, so it seemsl ike they were about to charge the flank and the order had been given. The phalanxes were facing hte wrong way, and they were in deep columns.

The chariots were facing the wrong way, but considering that 3 of the 5 phalanxes were in combat it seems unlikely that they would be able to form up to adequatly cover both the headhurlers and the chariots.

One archer was about to be rolled by the chariots and route (it was sahken) the other was actually the onager reformed with 8 men left.

That should clear up a lot of the misinformation going on at the thread. Note that I typed this all down *while* looking at a replay which in big bold letters at the top said "Replay Finished"

Coldy had only 2 units (1 chariot + 1 headhurler) route while Antonio had 2 Phalanxes, 5 cataphracts, and 3 archers route. If there can be no agreement on anything else, coldy caused more destruction up to the end of the replay than antonio did.

Edit: I was thinking about it, and actually Antonio wouldn't be able to block the chariots. The 3 phalanxes that are "in combat, although they are barely engaged, cannot be turned or moved or else the game engine would classify the headhurlers as flanking, which would cause the phalanxes to instant route. One of the two phalanxes not in combat is *completly* knocked down by the elephant, I mean there are only two guys standing, so by the time it is even able to move the headhurlers will be upon it. The other phalanx is somewhat knocked down, and would have to run through the phalanxes in combat to block the chariots, but even if it could it could mot possibly spread out enough to protect both the sides and the rear (Since they are in a a formation which is wide enough in both sides and rear that the chariots could plow through from either direction.) Those are facts that any player should be able to know, which demonstrates the onesidedness of the end of this battle.

Match two shuold just be played, if Antonio wins well then there is a third match. Either way, we should solve the problems when they come up. You guys are making this much harder than it is)

I wait LOUIS

Playing with I.A. it's easy for take screen shoot !!!!!!!!!!
No comment !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ps : Louis, j'accepte sous ton arbitrage de jouer les matchs de ce premier tour, mais tous les screens shoots que j'ai à ta disposition te montreront l'état d'esprit de Coldy et compagnie... Il a fait honneur à sa réputation d'avant tournoi, rappelle toi déja......... ses critiques...

La partie était gagné pour moi haut la main, mais j'accepte pour démontrer mon fair-play de la rejouer à nouveau...

GBY (certains joueurs abusent de la réputation des SAINTS pour contester leur défaite), cela devient monaie courante..

Antonio now i see than you are not just rude player - you are CHEATER
Yes you beated me 2 times (actually you were so brave that in 2nd you havent played with your real name) but remember 1st game - you lost. For me it was just training, looks like for you something more. My clan has some masters in charriot fighting and i asked them about these screens. Answer was simple - Antonio is dead. Furthermore we cant forget that charriots are falling enemys morale. If 2 pikemen were shaken, they would run just when charriots appear. Furthermore i have checked your behaviour in CWC - you were lying like a child. And when someone showed your lies - you were telling new.

You are veteran - do you know what i liked in VI veterans. They were fair, not like you.
I should tell something more about you but i dont want war with Saints, my respect for Louis and Avenger is one of reasons. You are just coward - be man and fight. Upps sorry - how someone with Artemis nick can be man.

Krook, now i see than you are not just rude player too - you are CHEATER

I dont have respect for u too....... Good bye coward and training you..
because i win always versus you... u want replay ????

ps : plz, dont speak never with me NOW....

HH summed that up good

Saint-Antonio a écrit:

I wait LOUIS

Playing with I.A. it's easy for take screen shoot !!!!!!!!!!
No comment !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ps : Louis, j'accepte sous ton arbitrage de jouer les matchs de ce premier tour, mais tous les screens shoots que j'ai à ta disposition te montreront l'état d'esprit de Coldy et compagnie... Il a fait honneur à sa réputation d'avant tournoi, rappelle toi déja......... ses critiques...

La partie était gagné pour moi haut la main, mais j'accepte pour démontrer mon fair-play de la rejouer à nouveau...

GBY (certains joueurs abusent de la réputation des SAINTS pour contester leur défaite), cela devient monaie courante..

What i find especially troubling about this remark and specifically this line "Playing with I.A. it's easy for take screen shoot !!!!!!!!!!
No comment !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" is suggesting that the screenshots were doctored(faked) by taking screenshots while vs a A.I player and pretending it was the match between coldy and antonio...now i think this is getting pretty low and scraping the bottom of the barrel and this sort of under handed mud slinging really is beyond what a reputable player would stoop to. (For anyone thinking its easy to do this trick...remember that when his men are highlighted you can see it doesnt say CPU nor when you VS the computer can you name the computer SAINT-ANTONIO)

Antonio you need to realise this isn't some big conspiracy against you and that everyone who posts here who isn't SAINT agrees you were pretty much destroyed and unfortunately for you after watching the replay i must agree, just chill and take it like a man because this one match is doing more damage to the SAINTS reputation than you can imagine. The irony here lies in that for a saint your really not acting like one.

First you have to wait for louis. He s back today (

For information for nimble nota stop forcing a date m8 you have your constraint and Louis has some too. So no way to write to the world that you have an appointment sunday it s not true. And plz nimblenota stop interfering. You are not concerned in the discussion between Antonio and Coldy.

First you have to check that you didn’t have a desynchronisation. You can check it into the file named /desynch I don’t remember where it is but I had the same pb few months ago and I m sure that if you had this pb both of you are telling the truth.

If you have something written in the file post it into this thread.

The council will meet soon.
1/ Send replay.
2/ Check you /desynch file and we will decide soon.

See you

And a last advise for those people who are not happy with the rules and send some comments in the RTW room. If you disagree with the rules leave this tournament. We have many players who would be happy to be in.
So this is an advice for Nimble nota and Coldy.
Stop talking and play.
If you want to create a tournament create it and we will see the number of player you will succeed in joigning.

So just to say that if you are not happy with the rules please leave. If you are not happy with the SAINTs pleaze leave. If you want to enjoy big fight against great players you re welcome in THE ONE.

Cya

KrooK najpierw do ciebie byłbym wdzieczny gdybys nie wyzywal moich Braci z klanu tylko dlatego ze przegrales z jednym z nich 2:0 Bardzo dobrze wiem ze nie lubisz przegrywac zreszta tak samo jak jak ale nie powinienes odrazu na zlosc stawac po stronie gosci ktorzy nie maja racji a tym bardziej nie powinienes wyzywac mojego Brata od CHEATER
proponuje dla twojego dobra zebys nie wtrancal sie w nie woje sprawy
a pilnowal swojego nosa.
Mozliwe ze Coldy wygralby te bitwe ale nie do konca moze i uciekali falanglici Tonio ale na bank by sie zebraly ze 2-3 odzialy wtedy Coldy moglby mu naskoczyc bo uciekalo nawet po 80 chlopa.
A jesli KrooK szukasz afer poszukaj ich w swoim klanie bo ja jak narazie nic do ciebie nie mam ale jesli tak dalej bedzie to cos zaczne miec
Wiec proponuje male przyslowiowe SHUT UP

Note what you think here that your topic is elsewhere so you made a mistake me something probably how like each other oneself in it your matter in your clan and SHUT UP here you it are not some judges in order to to estimate anything.

We are Honorable meybe you not but stop to offend my brothers
because I KILL YOU I Love My Brothers and I will salute for them my honour and life.
If you want WAR for me i dont see problems I LOVE PROBLEMS AND MY
SECOND NICK THEN PROBLEM

Coldy i think if you and Tonio have same Chance to Win and i think if you
SHOULD replay this battle STOP TEELING START PLAYING
This has to be the excellent party and it the war of words

GBY
Saint-Avenger

P.S. Nimble and you remember what i SEID

Read this file please...

GBY.
Saint-Louis

Avengar give me your msn And will organize some matches or please come to my clans forums and I will be happy to arrange some games with you or anyother saint... so long as they just do not dictate rules but rather talk and agree on rules.

Thank you have a good day